Turning Insecurity into Motivation (on Charlie & Ben Podcast) Pt.1 Sept. '21 Ep 410



In a thought-provoking conversation with Charlie and Ben from the Charisma on Command podcast, Alex Hormozi delves into the psychology of wealth, contrasting the mindsets of millionaires and billionaires, and discussing the nuanced use of money as a motivator and measure of success. Hormozi reveals insights into his personal drive to surpass his father's achievements and how this shaped his approach to business and life. He also touches on the value equation in business, emphasizing the importance of delivering desired outcomes efficiently with minimal effort from customers. Hormozi candidly shares his own insecurities, even as a successful entrepreneur, and how personal challenges have fueled his ambition. The discussion also explores the balance between monetizable challenges and personal growth, with Hormozi advocating for understanding one's motivations and redefining success on one's own terms.

Summary Notes

Mosey Nation's Appearance on Charisma on Command's Podcast

  • Mosey Nation discussed nonbusiness but business-related topics on the Charisma on Command podcast.
  • Topics included mindsets around money, the difference in thinking between millionaires and billionaires, and how to use money effectively.
  • The conversation also touched on using money as a measuring stick and turning insecurity into motivation.
  • Mosey Nation shared his personal journey, including his goal to surpass his father's achievements.

"I was just on the cocreators of Charisma on command's podcast. They have over 5 million subscribers and they had some very nonbusiness but business and money mindset questions specifically for me."

This quote introduces the context of the podcast appearance, highlighting the focus on money mindset and personal business-related questions directed at Mosey Nation.

Money as a Measuring Stick and Quality of Life

  • Speaker B questions the use of money as a measuring stick for success and asks about the true value additions to one's life from spending money.
  • Mosey Nation acknowledges the diminishing returns of money on quality of life after a certain point.
  • He shares personal indulgences that he finds worth the expense, such as flying private and living in places with views.
  • Mosey Nation has a non-emotional commitment to becoming a billionaire, believing it will increase his influence.

"The marginal utility of money decreases massively over time. Right. So your next million dollars makes significantly less impact on your life than your first million dollars."

Mosey Nation explains the concept of marginal utility and how additional wealth contributes less significantly to life satisfaction after a certain point.

Personal Motivations and Challenges

  • Speaker C inquires about Mosey Nation's motivation to work despite having substantial wealth.
  • Mosey Nation believes in the necessity of challenges for enjoyment in life and fears becoming complacent.
  • He shares his approach to work, focusing on enjoyable and stimulating activities but not avoiding difficult tasks that lead to desired outcomes.

"I believe that humans need challenges to enjoy life."

Mosey Nation expresses his philosophy that facing challenges is essential for fulfillment, which drives his work ethic and life choices.

Business Growth and Strategy

  • Mosey Nation distinguishes between the tactical focus of seven-figure entrepreneurs and the strategic, people-focused mindset of those with eight figures and beyond.
  • He emphasizes the importance of assembling a team and delegating tasks to grow a business, rather than getting caught up in individual tactics.
  • The discussion reflects the evolution of business strategy as entrepreneurs reach higher levels of financial success.

"All the people that I know who are, and I think we'll cross 100 million in revenue by probably end of Q one next year, maybe Q two next year. But the conversations that I have with all the guys that I know that are at that level and above, it's all about people."

This quote highlights the shift in business priorities from tactics to people management as entrepreneurs' businesses grow, underscoring the importance of team assembly in scaling operations.

Decision Making and Judgement of Others

  • The importance of making better judgments about people with a decreased error rate is highlighted.
  • The goal is to still acknowledge human errors but to minimize them.

guy knows his stuff. So that you can simply make better judgments on other human beings with decreasing error rate, you still have them, but just fewer errors.

This quote emphasizes the speaker's belief in the value of expertise and the aim to improve judgment about others while accepting that errors cannot be completely eliminated but can be reduced.

The Role of Challenges in Personal Fulfillment

  • The discussion explores whether challenges should be monetizable or purely for personal fulfillment.
  • The speaker indicates that challenges can be rewarding and fulfilling, and there is a balance between monetizable and non-monetizable challenges.

I do want to circle to this because I actually really need to figure out the hiring thing. But I do have one question because I agree that people need is a weird word, but I would say thrive on challenges. And challenges are rewarding and fulfilling.

The speaker is acknowledging the importance of challenges in life and their role in personal growth and fulfillment, setting the stage for further exploration of this topic.

The Motivation Behind Choosing Challenges

  • Speaker A is driven by a love for the business game rather than money.
  • They have set a goal of $100 million in profit per year with specific constraints, such as working only two to three days a week.
  • The speaker enjoys activities like making YouTube content, writing books, and doing podcasts.

Is not the driver. I just love the game of business so much.

This quote reveals that the speaker's primary motivation is their passion for business, not financial gain.

The Influence of Natural Proclivity and Luck in Success

  • The speaker believes that luck plays a significant role in success, including genetics and upbringing.
  • They suggest that while hard work is important, natural talent and proclivities also contribute to excelling in business.
  • The idea is presented that anyone can achieve top 1% wealth, but character traits and discipline are often lacking.

And so I think that everybody can be in the top 1%, that I believe, which means one to 5 million in investable assets. I believe everyone can do that in their lifespan, 100%. But most people don't have the character traits and the discipline to do that.

This quote posits that achieving significant financial success is possible for everyone, but it requires specific character traits and discipline that many may not possess.

Self-Awareness and Insecurity

  • Speaker A openly discusses feeling insecure about their wealth, indicating that even successful individuals have insecurities.
  • They express a desire for openness about personal flaws.

I literally feel pangs of insecurity that it's not that much money.

This quote shows the speaker's vulnerability and the internal struggle with self-worth, despite external success.

Learning to Love the Game of Business

  • Speaker A acknowledges that not everyone inherently loves business.
  • They suggest that it might be more beneficial for someone without a proclivity for business to partner with someone who does.
  • The importance of being able to judge others' abilities and negotiate deals is highlighted.

I think you'd probably be smarter for that person to go find someone who loves that game.

This quote suggests that for individuals who do not have a natural inclination for business, partnering with someone who does could be a more effective strategy.

Addressing Personal Insecurities

  • Speaker A and Speaker B discuss strategies for dealing with insecurities, including therapy and self-reflection.
  • The concept that understanding personal pain can help alleviate it is introduced.
  • The speakers share their experiences with self-doubt and how they've attempted to address it.

I would say that I think time dulls the sting of pain over a long enough time horizon.

This quote indicates that while time may lessen the immediate pain of insecurities, understanding the root cause is crucial for long-term resolution.

Mosey Nation's Personal Journey and Insights

  • Mosey Nation discusses his insecurities about his father's approval and how it influenced his life decisions.
  • He describes a pivotal moment when his father apologized for doubting his decisions after Mosey had achieved significant financial success.
  • Mosey reflects on the impact of his father's approval on his career choices and the mental health struggles he faced in his consulting career.
  • He explains how he built his life to be impenetrable to criticism as a defense mechanism.
  • Mosey Nation reveals his current focus on redefining his own game and creating a business aligned with his values, rather than the expectations set by others.

"I had these massive insecurities about my father's approval, right? So that was the thing that was withheld from me. My childhood, adulthood."

This quote highlights Mosey Nation's core emotional struggle with seeking his father's approval and how it was a driving force in his life.

"It was only when I had literally made more money than he'd ever made in his entire life that he said, you know, you're going to want to hear this."

Mosey Nation's father's acknowledgment of his success came only after a significant financial milestone was reached, indicating the father's value system based on financial achievement.

"Every aspect of my life has been built to be impenetrable."

Mosey Nation built his life to be beyond reproach as a means to protect himself from criticism and hurt, revealing his defensive strategy in life.

"What game do I want to play? And so it's been illuminating for me to try and redefine my own game."

This quote signifies Mosey Nation's shift in perspective, from playing the game set by others to defining and pursuing his own goals and values.

Shared Experiences and Understanding

  • Speaker B relates to Mosey Nation's experiences with his own father and the competitive dynamic in their relationship.
  • Speaker B shares a personal anecdote about using MDMA with his father to gain understanding and relates it to Mosey Nation's story.
  • The conversation acknowledges the generational differences in attitudes toward business and success.

"I just did MDMA with my dad. Oh, wow. It was not exactly the same."

Speaker B shares a personal experience that parallels Mosey Nation's story, indicating a common theme of seeking parental approval and understanding.

"In his era, that wasn't how you did things."

Speaker B recognizes the generational gap in perspectives on career and business, suggesting that what may not have worked in the past could be viable today.

The Value Equation in Business

  • Mosey Nation introduces the value equation from his book, which is a concept he believes contributes significantly to the marketing and business community.
  • The value equation consists of four variables that help determine why customers value one solution over another.
  • Mosey Nation illustrates the concept using the example of the fitness industry, comparing the revenue of supplements to gyms.
  • He explains each component of the value equation: dream outcome, perceived likelihood of achievement, and the additional variables that influence a customer's purchasing decision.

"The value equation. And the reason that it actually came to be was because this came to me, like, three years ago when I was building our supplement company."

Mosey Nation introduces the value equation as a key concept in his book, inspired by his experience in the supplement industry.

"The first part of the equation is dream outcome, which is, what is the experience or transformation that a customer is going to go through."

The dream outcome is the promised experience or transformation that a product or service offers, which heavily influences customer perception and the price they are willing to pay.

"Perceived likelihood of achievement... the knowledge that this guy's done 10,000 versus the knowledge that this guy's done zero actually provides value that can be translated into increased pricing power to a prospect."

The perceived likelihood of achievement is the customer's belief in the effectiveness of a product or service, which can justify higher prices and is exemplified by the reputation and experience of a service provider.

Discussion on Business and Personal Values

  • The conversation shifts to business and personal values, with Mosey Nation expressing his enjoyment in making money and discussing business.
  • Speaker B reflects on the duality of recognizing the silliness of the "game" while also being deeply invested in it.
  • The dialogue highlights the balance between personal fulfillment and the pursuit of success in business.

"I'm happy to talk about money, mind you. I enjoy making money and all the things about it, so I'm happy to talk."

Mosey Nation indicates his willingness to discuss business and financial topics, suggesting that despite his personal journey, he still finds value in monetary success.

"This is my life, man. I love going in and out. I love sitting up here and talking about like, dude, this whole game is bullshit. This is all silly, and it doesn't matter. And then fucking screaming when I'm losing. How do I get better at this game?"

Speaker B shares his perspective on the paradox of business, where one can simultaneously recognize its absurdity and yet be fully engaged in its challenges and rewards.

Delicate Dance of Desire and Supply-Demand Curve

  • The pricing strategy of high-end services like liposuction is influenced by the delicate dance of desire and the supply-demand curve.
  • Clients are willing to pay a premium for certain services because of the high perceived likelihood of achieving their desired outcome.

"And part of that is because of the delicate dance of desire. Right. The supply demand curve."

The quote explains that the willingness of clients to pay high prices for services such as liposuction is partly due to the interplay between desire (demand) and availability (supply).

Dream Outcome and Perceived Likelihood

  • Dream outcome refers to the experience or result that a service or product promises to provide.
  • Perceived likelihood is the prospect's belief in achieving the dream outcome upon purchase.
  • Higher prices can correlate with a higher perceived likelihood of achieving the desired result, as seen in the comparison between a $9 ebook and liposuction for weight loss.

"Number one for everybody is dream outcome. What's the experience or what's the thing that we're providing? Number two is the perceived likelihood that the prospects believe, that, they believe that they will achieve it upon purchase."

This quote highlights the two fundamental factors influencing a customer's decision to purchase: the promised experience (dream outcome) and the customer's belief in the likelihood of achieving that outcome (perceived likelihood).

Role of Testimonials and Marketing

  • Testimonials substitute for word of mouth in situations where personal recommendations are absent.
  • Marketing, messaging, sales, stories, and market positioning all contribute to establishing the perceived likelihood of achieving the desired outcome for new prospects.

"So many fills the hole that word of mouth does not have for a business."

The quote suggests that testimonials and marketing efforts fill the gap left by the absence of word-of-mouth recommendations, thereby influencing the perceived likelihood of achieving the desired outcome.

Time Delight and Immediate Value

  • Time delight refers to the time span between making a purchase and experiencing the result.
  • Providing the same service in half the time is an easy way to create value.
  • Immediate results greatly enhance the perceived value of a product or service.

"The goal is that time is a huge component of value. Fast beats free."

This quote emphasizes that reducing the time it takes for customers to experience the benefits of a product or service significantly increases its value.

Effort and Sacrifice

  • Effort is the additional work a customer must undertake as a result of the purchase.
  • Sacrifice is what the customer must give up as a result of the purchase.
  • Minimizing effort and sacrifice is crucial for creating a valuable product or service.

"Effort, sacrifice. I see them as two sides of the same coin."

The quote explains that effort and sacrifice are two aspects of the cost of a purchase that both detract from the product's value and should be minimized.

Operational Advantage and Competitive Defensibility

  • Companies that focus on reducing time delay and minimizing effort/sacrifice have a competitive advantage.
  • The operational side of providing value is more defensible than marketing claims and testimonials.
  • Aim for zero effort and sacrifice to create an infinitely valuable product.

"The hard part is actually having the operational advantage of figuring out the way to provide the thing faster and provide the thing without effort and sacrifice on behalf of the prospect."

This quote points out that the truly challenging and valuable part of business is to operationally deliver a product or service quickly and with minimal effort or sacrifice required from the customer.

Designing Valuable Products

  • Product improvement should focus on every detail of the customer experience, from pre-purchase to post-result.
  • The goal is to make each step of the process as seamless and effortless as possible.
  • This includes optimizing service delivery and product design for maximum ease of use.

"How can I lubricate that? How can I make it faster and easier for them so that when they get to that, they just click cheat code and then they move through."

The quote suggests that the key to product improvement is to streamline the customer experience to the point where it feels effortless, akin to using a cheat code.

Anticipating Part Two of the Interview

  • The interview will continue in a second part, promising to delve deeper into the discussed concepts.
  • The hosts, Charlie and Ben, are praised for their contributions to the conversation.

"Hope you guys enjoyed the first part of the two part interview with those guys. Charlie and Ben are really awesome dudes and I think you guys will really dig what is coming into part two of this where we dive even deeper."

The quote serves as a teaser for the second part of the interview, indicating that there will be more in-depth discussion on the topics introduced in the first part.

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